Live WWE TV Discussion Thread

[Powder]

Yeah, it's Randy Orton, The Amazing Mr. Montone.

[Oliver]

But that's what I'm wondering. They booked themselves into a bit of a corner to begin with, no doubt, but it wouldn't be the first time that a popular babyface had gotten pushed to the main event, only to be put back down.

Let's say for the sake of argument, they just didn't change course. Maybe they plan for Bryan to do something with Orton or Batista after Mania. But Randy Orton vs Dave Batista is the main event of WrestleMania 30, and maybe Bryan gets Triple H since Hunter needs a match.

But they never book the Occupy Raw angle, and literally just ignore the desire to push Bryan into the main event of WrestleMania. WWE subconsciously tells their fans in one angle that no matter how hard you cheer for someone else, we have a plan and we're going to execute it, either watch or don't.

Do people walk away, and if so where do they go? What happens to the Network? Is the main event boo'd out of the building (we hadn't really gotten there with fans on a mainstream basis yet)? Is it really all that dire a situation for WWE at all or just business as usual? And where is audience entitlement, "give me what I want, when I want it", today?

I think they could have pushed everything back a little. They run Orton vs Batista and Bryan vs HHH, and Bryan vs HHH keeps the 'if Bryan wins he gets a title shot' stipulation, but it's not on the same night. They keep Batista as a face into Mania, but have him turn afterwards in the same way that he did - and then you build to Bryan vs Batista somewhere in the summer.

There's so much around that time that could have had a huge impact, though - Punk not walking out would have left Bryan somewhere else as by all accounts he was set to face HHH, so what's then for Bryan? If they'd booked the Rumble a little differently, and had Bryan involved or something, that would have probably changed Batista's ending in that match (they could have had HHH take Bryan out of the Rumble or something). Lots of stuff could have shifted in that and changed the way things were received.

[PEN15v2]

COACH, coming back to the promos about "living my dream"...etc. I am reading a recap of what took place on WWE Backstage last night, and Drew McIntyre was talking about being ready to be the top guy.

I think wrestling has changed so much, and connects to those promos, and why stars of previous generations didn't talk that way. Nobody back then talked about being "the face of the company" or "the top guy" either.

[Powder]

I think it also has to do with being the 'face of the company' vs being champion.

Let's look to recent years. Since 2017 Brock Lesnar had a 504 day run as Universal Champion and AJ Styles had a 371 day run as WWE Champion. Those are the two longest runs with each respective title.

I know that Styles called himself the 'face that runs this place' in regards to Smackdown. But were either one of those guys the 'face of the company' regardless of being the company's top 2 champions?

Lesnar...no way. He would never do what is necessary to be the 'face of the company', and I, for one, do not believe that AJ Styles was the 'face of the WWE' in 2017-2018.

I think that last year in 2019, Becky Lynch was the 'face of the WWE', while being the RWC.

But there are people on the roster that will be the 'face of the company' but not the top champion. For instance, Charlotte and Reigns. The WWE wants them both to be the respective faces, but they are not always the champion.

Some people just want to hold title (Lesnar) and not do all that comes with it. Some people want/love the media and 'FOTC' mumbo jumbo, like the Miz.

And in a way, you could argue that the Miz is the "face of the WWE' for almost the past 10 years. He has been everywhere, all over the media, movies, TV shows, talk shows, anywhere and everywhere. He is reliable and a go to guy for the WWE when it comes to promotion. So he in a way is the true face of the WWE.

[Team Farrell]

COACH, coming back to the promos about "living my dream"...etc. I am reading a recap of what took place on WWE Backstage last night, and Drew McIntyre was talking about being ready to be the top guy.

I think wrestling has changed so much, and connects to those promos, and why stars of previous generations didn't talk that way. Nobody back then talked about being "the face of the company" or "the top guy" either.

See, that's a tough one. WWE Backstage seems to be a little more "shoot" than anything else, and I could see the real guy Drew Galloway genuinely believing and saying that.

But "face of the company" is another of those meaningless terms that's really come into the forefront in the past five to 10 years. It's a nebulous title that doesn't mean anything. I can relate to wanting to be Champion, you get more exposure you get more money, you become a bigger star. But what do you get for being "the face of the company"? A video game cover?

Powder just pointed out a half dozen people that could be considered the "face of the company" at one point or another in the past few years. So what does that even mean? Theoretically, shouldn't holding the title make you the face of the company? Maybe not anymore, because there's so many belts.

Maybe that's why all this stuff annoys me. Drew Galloway should feel ready and like he wants to be the "face of the company", but Drew McIntyre should want to kick Brock's ass and take his belt. It feels more and more like they're asking Drew Galloway or Trevor Mann or Mike Mizanin to deliver promos on TV rather than the characters they're supposed to be playing.

Wrestling was more over and more popular when Hulk Hogan cut promos, not Terry Bollea, the husband and father. Even when The Rock shows up, he's The Rock that we all knew and loved with the biting wit and catchphrases, not the super positive, kind Dwayne Johnson that we've come to know that he actually is.

[PEN15v2]

I've seen too many people say "face of the company" in character on TV, that it melds into the shoot style of Backstage to me.

But you're right. I can't think of many promos about the drive to be champion. Miz has, but he also turned it into something shoot wise about making the title relevant. Even with Brock as champ, Rollins and Roman promoed about bringing the title back to TV every week. It works, and I did enjoy that aspect. But so rarely is it about proving they are the best, and that's why they should be champion.

That said, the women are much better at that. It's odd.

[T.O.]

I think part of it is, if you ask casuals or non fans to pick a wrestler when you say WWE, who do they pick?

It's probably overwhelmingly either Brock Lesnar or John Cena, still

[comfortablynumb]

I gotta admit, I felt a little sad for Otis when he saw Dolph at the table.

[PEN15v2]

It was well done. I like the idea of a midcard tag feud, Machinery VS Glorious Douchebags

[Powder]

So it seems that that WWE has watched some AEW. and responded in kind. RAW is all picture in the picture, like AEW, and tey have some curse words. Baszler was allowed to say 'Shit".

[PEN15v2]

AEW, really?

NXT was picture in picture since their debut. They've done it on SDL plenty of times. I'm sure Raw has too.

WWE said shit several times in the past, and I'm not talking from the Attitude Era only. They really save it all for special occasions, just like the blood.


I'm not saying AEW isn't going to have an influence on WWE, but there's far more influence of WWE on AEW than vice versa. Basically, AEW is doing what WWF used to do on a regular basis.

[Oliver]

So it seems that that WWE has watched some AEW. and responded in kind. RAW is all picture in the picture, like AEW, and tey have some curse words. Baszler was allowed to say 'Shit".

Where does your obsession in declaring that WWE is 'responding' to AEW come from, Powder? Feels like it comes up in conversation every week.

Have you all seen the backstage bit of Queen Cathy and the UE? It's really good. Kyle O'Reilly has got this really weird charisma to him that could come over really well of they gave him a singles run.

https://mobile.twitter.com/StephanieHypes/status/1229261662655414272

[PEN15v2]

It was nice, and while all the female broadcasters are attractive and show talent, Cathy seemed special and above the rest. I'm guessing she was looking for more of a role like Renee or Charly, but they are both great at their jobs too, and young enough that they aren't going to open up a spot for Cathy anytime soon. Outside of Charly and Renee, I thin Sarah Schriver had the most potential.

Bland raw. Some interesting parts, but nothing that really grabbed me.

[Oliver]

I kind of have a weird fascination with Brock vs Ricochet. I can't say much is going to make me actually sit and watch it, but Ricochet can do ridiculous things with his body that might make Brock throwing him around really fun.

Asuka shoving Natalya out of the way so she could have a face off with Shayna is pretty much how my wrestling brain works. That was a really effective segment. I don't necessarily like that WWE is establishing a pretty clear rivalry between Shayna and Becky before the Chamber match, as it makes it feel like a foregone conclusion - but I can't argue that the way they are approaching it isn't effective.

[PEN15v2]

As questionable as the Goldberg title win may be, I can honestly say I haven't been this interested in watching Smackdown since the first Fox episode.