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Limitless Keith Lee Thread

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  • #91
    The thing is, he doesn't look "fat" the way someone like Chris Hero looks like he just doesn't take care of himself. He's built like an athlete who carries extra weight.

    He's build like a defensive lineman, which is exactly the position he used to play in college.

    I don't really see the need for him to lose weight if he's able to do the things that got him over.
    https://youtu.be/wue-ZFnEta8
    My latest (and hopefully last) Covid-Era show

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Buzzard Guts View Post

      Isn't that a bit of a double standard when they're pushing females like Nia Jax and Doudrop?
      I'm not saying that Lee should be cut like the other guys, just more the size he was in NXT, like he was here:

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      • #93
        I can see your point. From Vince's perspective he might feel like he was "sold" the Keith Lee in that photograph.

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        • #94
          Because it's much harder to stay in shape the older you are; it's not necessary; he still has an impressive look.

          Will his additional bulk get him released? No, not without an honest attempt made to push him. But it might be what holds him back from a major main event push if he doesn't have a major connection with the audience somehow.

          You have to keep in mind that the one flaw I've noticed in Vince's "size" obsession was fat guys. Bundy, Yokozuna, Earthquake, Typhoon/Tugboat... they were all pushed higher than they would have been elsewhere because of their size. They were all huge dudes, but had they reduced to 300-350 pounds, they would have looked the size of Ax and Smash. I'm not saying they weren't good wrestlers, but they weren't as good as their push. Shit, is Otis all that special these days besides his bulk? Even as comedy Otis, he wasn't a main event guy, yet won the MITB contract.

          Lee is already in a great spot. Like Kross, he's being placed above the midcard without working his way up. Like Damian Priest, Kross and Lee are ready for a top of the card program any time they need to insert someone new into the mix. I don't know if any of them will be the next Cena or Roman, but they certainly are capable of being the next McIntyre as a guy who can be the new babyface and constant main event guy, but who can move down the card when needed.


          As for the nickname, it's one of the mildest adjustments ever. It doesn't hurt him in the slightest, and gives something simple that can be worked on. I think of it more like Batista's "Animal" nickname. It doesn't take over his persona, but it gives some nice catch phrase options, logo designs, and anything else it might lead into. As long as he doesn't start clawing the mat because a tackle, it's harmless and only has potential.

          Also, I'm glad he went back to the Fireman's Carry Jackhammer as his finish. I like Powerbombs too, but I prefer this.
          Last edited by PEN15v2; 09-28-2021, 11:42 PM.

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          • #95
            To be fair, I never said it was harmful. It's just a bit odd. Quite interesting if you are into wrestling history. Plus hard to know who could have come up with it other than Vince himself. Prichard, maybe, at a push.

            As I say, just a bit weird. In a world where WWE features Alexa Bliss being possessed and 'eye for an eye' matches, an homage to someone who hasn't wrestled since the 1970s and that I don't think I ever even heard mentioned on WWE TV stands out quite strongly. It won't matter because I don't think most people even know the reference but that doesn't make it any less weird if you do.


            "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

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            • #96
              I think the fact that no one would connect it to whoever you're talking about might be a sign that it's a coincidence and not an homage.

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              • #97
                Well, people have connected it, for one thing. Elsewhere, I've seen several people mention it. If you know that period of wrestling history it's likely the first thing you think of when you hear the name.

                You can of course believe it's a coincidence if you want to, but it seems much more likely to me that it's inspired by something that someone has heard in the past and tried to use again. Maybe homage is the wrong word but it's very hard for to me to believe that there's no connection at all - and don't think anyone familiar with Bearcat Wright didn't immediately think of him when they heard the name used.

                He was also put in the WWE hall of fame a few years ago too, don't forget, so it's not like he's never been on the company radar, nor is he some mid-century job guy. As a babyface he'd have worked for Capitol or the WWWF against some of the people Vince McMahon has said were his favourite wrestlers, in his youth. So yeah, I don't personally buy that it's a coincidence. There may not be the smoking gun evidence that you'd need for a court of law but just to make your mind up about something this inconsequential the circumstantial evidence is more than sufficient, in my opinion.


                And besides, it doesn't really matter. It's a bit odd, as I say, but it's hardly life or death and whether it gets over or not will be based on other things.

                "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

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                • #98
                  It's still a stretch, considering it's a nickname for American football players and I think a common college or university team name.

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                  • #99
                    I honestly see the idea that it's not connected as way more of a stretch (and a quick search seems to suggest he's the most famous person called Bearcat out there), but anyway. We've already spent more time on this than it's worth.

                    I don't know if this changes anything but I never intended it as a criticism. Things can be odd and still work out just fine. And for what it's worth, although it's weird as a reference to the wrestler.... if it is a pure coincidence, given everything I think that might actually be weirder still.


                    "The worst moron is the one too stupid to realise they're a moron."

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                    • Cornette had plenty to say on this recently.

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                      • I think a combination of a misleading photo above and unflattering ring gear isn't helping Keith Lee. Look back at his debut match with Marcel Barthel:

                        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fTi...ab_channel=WWE

                        I really suspect that below that singlet he isn't a million miles away from that shape. The phot taken from him probably posing/flexing a bit post-match compared to his in ring action isn't an especially fair one, really.

                        Equally, I think the five months 'battling death' in his words might grant him a little bit of leniency if he has put on a little bit of extra weight.

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                        • Originally posted by PEN15v2 View Post
                          Because it's much harder to stay in shape the older you are; it's not necessary; he still has an impressive look.

                          Will his additional bulk get him released? No, not without an honest attempt made to push him. But it might be what holds him back from a major main event push if he doesn't have a major connection with the audience somehow.

                          You have to keep in mind that the one flaw I've noticed in Vince's "size" obsession was fat guys. Bundy, Yokozuna, Earthquake, Typhoon/Tugboat... they were all pushed higher than they would have been elsewhere because of their size. They were all huge dudes, but had they reduced to 300-350 pounds, they would have looked the size of Ax and Smash. I'm not saying they weren't good wrestlers, but they weren't as good as their push. Shit, is Otis all that special these days besides his bulk? Even as comedy Otis, he wasn't a main event guy, yet won the MITB contract.

                          Lee is already in a great spot. Like Kross, he's being placed above the midcard without working his way up. Like Damian Priest, Kross and Lee are ready for a top of the card program any time they need to insert someone new into the mix. I don't know if any of them will be the next Cena or Roman, but they certainly are capable of being the next McIntyre as a guy who can be the new babyface and constant main event guy, but who can move down the card when needed.


                          As for the nickname, it's one of the mildest adjustments ever. It doesn't hurt him in the slightest, and gives something simple that can be worked on. I think of it more like Batista's "Animal" nickname. It doesn't take over his persona, but it gives some nice catch phrase options, logo designs, and anything else it might lead into. As long as he doesn't start clawing the mat because a tackle, it's harmless and only has potential.

                          Also, I'm glad he went back to the Fireman's Carry Jackhammer as his finish. I like Powerbombs too, but I prefer this.
                          The only 'problem' I see with your comparisons to the to guys you mentions, is that with the exception of Yoko, all were a product of the 80s wrestling scene, where each was given a main event push, fed to Hogan and then spent the rest of their career (mostly) in the midcard. if they came up now, maybe things would be different, but none of them, again except Yoko, would ever be a WWF/E Champion.

                          Lee can and will get pushed, but he needs to find his voice. He needs to be able to cut a good promo to be a top champion. His size and ability will not matter if he still is just ok on the mic.

                          And I agree, the New/Old Finishing move is much better.


                          Originally posted by Oliver View Post
                          I think a combination of a misleading photo above and unflattering ring gear isn't helping Keith Lee. Look back at his debut match with Marcel Barthel:

                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fTi...ab_channel=WWE

                          I really suspect that below that singlet he isn't a million miles away from that shape. The phot taken from him probably posing/flexing a bit post-match compared to his in ring action isn't an especially fair one, really.

                          Equally, I think the five months 'battling death' in his words might grant him a little bit of leniency if he has put on a little bit of extra weight.

                          In that match, Lee was still slimmer than he is now.
                          Last edited by Powder; 09-29-2021, 12:14 PM.

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                          • Originally posted by Powder View Post
                            In that match, Lee was still slimmer than he is now.
                            I'm not denying that he might be bigger now, I'm saying I don't think he's so much bigger than he was. Billed weights are all a nonsense anyway, I wouldn't put any weight (ha) behind them.

                            Haven't we had this discussion before?

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                            • If they have bothered to give him a new nickname it seems like his weight doesn't matter, at least to Vince

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                              • And he was a TV draft pick, not the Talking Smack rounds.

                                The thing to remember, though it's easy to forget, is that being off TV is better than being in TV without direction. It's been said plenty of times before, but being off TV isn't necessarily about being in catering. Sometimes they have a plan but need the right time. I have no idea why these past 2 weeks were the right time, but being treated above Rey Mysterio, Jeff Hardy, Apollo Crews, Oris/Gable, John Morrison, Mansoor/Ali (who went in the next rounds) is a good sign.

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