Real Conversation Between 2 Educated Black Men about Gilbert Arenas

[SoL]

excuse the "creative" title but i wasn't feeling very creative.

fvk's post reminded me about wanting to post this exchange that i had with a friend of mine regarding the gilbert arenas situation. a lot of the conversation went beyond what that idiot did, and it made me think of a lot of the discussions that i've had on this board regarding racial issues. i figured some of you would be interested in reading this as it is a real conversation between two young, college educated black men on what was a very topical issue in the news a couple weeks ago.

not sure what kind of response i'm expecting (if any) but some of you may find this interesting (my text is white, his is yellow):

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what you think about this situation with gilbert arenas?

He has not been charged with any crime,. The idea that the commissioner suspended him without allowing law enforcement to finish their investigation, just confirms there is a witch hunt on young black athletes. David stern, covered up Jordan's Mafia ties, cause he was a yes man. Our generation is not subservient like the generation before, therefore elder white men will strip away a Young black males finances at anytime. To me it don't matter, cause they can only replace him with another young brother. Tiger Woods was last month, Gilbert this month I wonder whose next? They now trying to chastise Mayweather for requesting blood samples for a championship bout, but they road Barry Bonds for years over the same request. Watch yo back we under attack

it's interesting that you take that stance. if gilbert didn't act like a "witch" there would be no "witch hunt."

i agree, stern is making an example out of him, but why give him a reason to make an example out you? especially being a black man in america, he already knows they try to keep us on a tight leash. and to make matters worse rather than downplaying it he makes light of the situation with the comments he made afterwords and his pre-game antics before the 76ers game.

this ain't about being "subservient" in my opinion, it's about a guy who watches too much tv, has too much money, and made poor decisions all around.

like why does he even own guns? a gold plated desert eagle? really? that just SCREAMS protecting my family.

We were not in the locker room when the incident happened, we do not know Gilbert personally. Therefore, we are relying on information and blaspheme coming from a racist media. I do not take anything from the media face value especially when referring to Black males. < Malcolm X told us years ago that the media is out to castrate the black man, I hope you do not assume that that is no longer the case.

The constitution states that an individual has a right to bear arms, so why are we so shocked that someone owns a gun, especially a man who makes millions. If you were in his shoes you would be flat out naive not to own a gun.

Did he violate the league no gun policy? Yes he did and thats it, however an all out media assassination is an all out assassination of young black males. The media is trying to portray that he used the gun with some for of viscious intent, if that were the case Im sure the Washington Wizards organization would have called the police immediately and suspended him.

Gilbert Arenas is who he is, he would be an idiot to transform his personality and character for me, you, the media, and society as a whole. The comments he made after the 76ers game is his prerogative. If he does not care about being suspended or carrying a gun, then why the hell should we. Lets move on and stop talking about it. Conversely, the media wants to keep this image in the minds of society as long as possible.

Understand that acting like a witch in 2010 is basically being Black. I am not acting like a witch, but believe you me there is a witch hunt against me. I run an educational consulting company, and you would not believe how many times I have been in court and have had frivolous claims filed against me. Its a waste of my time and money being spent on legal fees.

I'm not justifying his actions, but the fact of the matter is that his actions are irrelevant to whats going on in society, however the media makes his situation and tigers the most relevant. Im sure theirs more conducive things and real life problems going on that you and I could discuss. Don't you think.

Lets talk about the education system that graduates 50% of all students, lets talk about poverty, gang violence, sexism, racism, and unjust wars, a banking system that has robbed the future of our children. Lets talk about that. However, for the past month its been all about Tiger Woods, and Gilbert Arenas. ATHLETES WHO GIVES A CARE ABOUT ATHLETES AND THEIR LIVES. The only people who care is the white establishment, because they want to embed in the minds of individual irrelevant issues, instead of issue that are.

I do not support these athletes at all, it just erks me when its constantly in the news, and people spend all day talking about it when in fact it does not affect anything going on around us.

i agree with what you're saying in general, i just don't think it applies to this case. my eyes are wide open to how things still work in this country, but i don't like applying it to when the person at hand was in the wrong.

regardless of what's going on around this situation, gilbert arenas was wrong and he handled the aftermath wrong.

and i wouldn't own a gun if i was a millionaire. and when has owning a gun ever protected any of these athletes/celebrities? the next time i hear about how "it was a good thing "so-and-so" had his gun on him because if he didn't he would've been robbed/killed/etc" will be the first. if he was concerned about his safety then he should've hired personal security.

and owning guns does not = acting black. that's what upsets me about the media, they try to associate things like guns, sex exploitation, and drugs with being a part of "black culture." and i guess this situation bothers me because gilbert's actions feeds into that stereotype. so the white people in iowa who's only encounters with black people are through tv see something like this and think, "well, i guess that is how blacks act even if they're rich."

None of this upsets me at all. I really don't care about a wannabe thug millionaire athlete. Neither do I care about what stereotypes white people associate with black men. I am 100% secure with myself as a black man, negative media depicted images of black men does not rattle my nerves. The truth of society shall be told on judgememt day

I agree with all that you said, however your sensitivity to Gilbert's actions prove the media has succeeded. His actions should not upset you. You should be upset with the media for bringing this story into your life, as well as the lives of Others.

White people in Iowa see only negative images of Blacks of Course. Its not anyone's fault except for the broadcasting company who delivers the news. If blacks were well behaved they would still find stories of negativity to publish. RACIST OWN THE MEDIA! Simply put, rich whites kids act up 10 time's worse than rich young black males! HEATH LEDGER, KIM BASSINGER, CASEY JOHNSON, DJ. AM! All died from drug overdose in the past year,what's worst than that.The media don't publicize those stories as much as others.

Understand the information you read and see comes from privately owned multimedia corporations. Stand proud as a blackman and dust those stereotypes off, cause we got the world on lock, check the stats baby.

maybe upset was the wrong word, maybe disappointed. i feel our folks who have a platform should try hard to portray a responsible image. i know that's not what gilbert signed up for when he joined the league, but the fact remains is that young (black) kids look up to that dude whether he likes it or not. and whether it's right or wrong, a guy like gilbert has a lot of influence on young (black) kids, so i think there is a responsibility that comes with his money and fame.

but that's just me. and i agree that when a famous black person messes up it gets magnified 100 times, at the same time though i don't think you can make a guy like gilbert the victim in this type of case when he does something he had no business doing.

it's one thing to make a mistake...drive drunk, cheat, whatever, but this goes beyond that. and if it just ended with him bringing the gun to the arena i'd probably see things the way you did, but his reaction and actions after all this was brought to light led me to the conclusion that he's a guy who doesn't get it.

and again, i worked in the media for almost 10 years so i know the game. you know what's interesting, is you're talking about how the people who run things are racist...a lot of conservatives (who have racist beliefs) constantly accuse the media of being liberal and "politically correct." i think there is truth to both. bottom line, like you said you have to look beyond what the machine is feeding you.

To be honest with you I dont think that young black kids are influenced by ball players as much as we assume. My role models were Wu-Tang Clan, and all them brothers is thugged out. I did not go that route. Charles Barkley said it a long time ago parents are role models, and if there are no parents, then tough luck they just got to live with that. I thought Barack was the new role model?

Who was Gilbert Arenas Role Model, can we blame Jordan, Rodman, Lawrence Taylor, or Charles Barkley for him going bad? No we not placing the blame on these guys. We cut our youth short when we tell them to look up to a ball player. An athlete has the right to reject the idea of being a role model. It is so difficult to change a grown man into someone we want them to be.

The bottom line is this. Blacks are uneducated, if young black males were educated they would not need good role models. Even if they did have good role models, but the lack of education remained the same, the results would not differ. If your ignorant your ignorant theres nothing a good role model can do for you. All the blacks who grew up in the 70's had Muhammad Ali, Jim Brown, and Bill Russell as role models. These men were outstanding, but all the brothers and sisters from the 70's ended up on crack cocaine in the 80's. Due to their lack of education.

The media is liberal dude, CNN, MSNBC, ESPN, ABC, Dateline, NBC Today Show, CBS Good Morning America, 20/20, 60 Minutes, New York Times, LA Times, Washington Post. All of their journalist are confirmed liberals, and these are the ones who spin the story in our ears. PETA, is a liberal organization, they took down Mike Vick. The Washington Post is a liberal newspaper, they broke the story on Gilbert Arenas and started the rumor of him pulling out a gun over a gambling debt. TMZ is owned by a self proclaimed Jewish Liberal Harvey Levin, and they broke the story on Tiger Woods, and found all his mistresses. Lets not get political, cause I will change you into a conservative, lol. By the way Bush had more blacks on his cabinet than Obama and Clinton combined!!!

your third paragraph is the truth, which is why it bothers me so much that this country would rather dump money in prisons rather than improving the school systems. education is the key.

i do think kids are heavily influenced by athletes and anyone else in the media. that's not just black kids, that's everyone. and i think about all the time about the music you and i listened to in JUNIOR high, and the people we were role modeled after. the difference between you and i and most everyone else is that we aren't easily influenced for whatever reason (probably because of our education and the people we had in our lives in our family). but realize that everyone is not strong minded like us and everyone doesn't have people in their lives to tell that that what 50 cent is talking about may be fun to listen to , but that's not real life.

Check out this link http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/W...ys-like-Arenas.

Its an article about Gilbert Arenas, what he's saying is true. However, his language and emotion is too far out of line. In fact lawmakers on capitol hill are responsible for the housing crisis, poor education, unjust wars, drug trafficking, the list goes on and on. However, you wont find not one article on the web or in printed circulation, that has language this strong towards a political figure. Thats why im not buying excerted anger towards young black male athletes, when no one else is publicly crucified for their wrong doings that are greater.

[MissouriDragon]

Didn't know you were friends with Trajik Lestat.

As a pro-gun guy, I would have accepted Arena's initial story ("I didn't want the guns in my house anymore"), but why didn't he just sell them? In my experience, if you want to get rid of a pistol, it's not very hard at all, in fact it's very easy. Hilarious story, I would like to meet that guy.

[Son of Repoman]

When the hell did Kim Basinger die?

Good read, but I'll comment after work.

[Slap]

"it is a real conversation between two young, college educated black men on what was a very topical issue in the news a couple weeks ago."

You come off wanting some special props because you graduated college and you just so happen to be black as well. "I'm black and not a delinquent so my take on issues is how the black community really feels". I obviously subed in delinquent for a bad word, but I'm sure you get my point.

Arenas pulled a gun on a teammate in a locker room over a gambling debt. Stern is a bitch and didn't do anything from the get-go like he should have, but then to make matters worse, Arenas does the shit where he acted as if he was shooting his teammates with his fingers during an intro before a game. That pissed Stern off to finally do something about it and he made the right move. If you really think you have a legit argument to defend Arenas actions in anyway then you are not intelligent by any means. Backing a guy cause he's a "young black athlete" is BS.

[TheAman]

I stopped reading after the first line. Yes, he was charged with a crime. A felony gun possession. So everything he says afterwords is asinine.

[SoL]

Originally Posted by Slap

You come off wanting some special props because you graduated college and you just so happen to be black as well. "I'm black and not a delinquent so my take on issues is how the black community really feels". I obviously subed in delinquent for a bad word, but I'm sure you get my point.

i'll take the shot, but that wasn't my intention.

many of the people who have a voice in the black community don't represent the voice of blacks in my circle...rational, younger, college educated who don't base their opinions on some kind of political or publicity agenda. REAL people in other words.

[Steve]

Sorry Sol but you should change the title "Real Conversation Between 1 Educated Black Man and Jesse Ventura about Gilbert Arenas" because your friend sounds gripped by paranoia that everything's a conspiracy. I'm sorry, but ramblings like that are usually written in feces on padded walls.

That being I said, I totally agree with him that Gilbert Arenas is getting fucked. Though, not because he's black, but because David is an puritan asshole who believes that NBA players need to held to some superhuman standard as role models, which is disgusting. Just because someone is famous doesn't mean they should have to act like someone something their not.

[Brooklyn]

Is your friend an Alan Keyes/Louis Farakhan hybrid? Interesting take from the Black Conservative. I think he makes one pretty good point, but his conspiratorial tone really detracts from it. I think it makes people not want to hear/read what he is saying.

His good point is that in the grand scheme of things, an entertainer or an athlete should NOT be as important in society as they are. As your conservative black friend stated, there are far more important issues that could be covered or addressed. The star ball player or singer should not be as influential on young people(in this particular case black people) as they appear to be(as far as behavior). Blame falls partly on the media for the crazy amount of exposure they heap on celebrities but blame also falls on us for caring about it as much as we do. If athletes should consider themselves role models, then us people with good sense need to take on that mantle as well. I mean we are actually tangible. We have a chance to directly influence the lives of the young people we come in contact with daily.

As for his other point:
In the case of Gilbert Arenas, there is no witch hunt. He did something wrong, he got caught and then got a punishment. He could have handled this much better and possibly protected his own image. Instead he basically downplayed it and make a joke of it. Showing contrition is not about "shuckin and jivin" for the man, its about taking responsibility for something you did. Your friend should realize that.

[Flikk]

while I'll agree that entertainers/athletes shouldn't have as big of an impact on society, the fact remains they do. You can ask a kid what they want to be when they grow up and chances are if they're honest with you they probably want a job in one of those two fields. As such, who is the kid that wants to be a basketball player going to look at as the 'blueprint' of what they want to be: LeBron James or Colin Powell? The question really becomes should LeBron be forced to be a strong role model due to this? I'd personally say no.

"He has not been charged with any crime,. The idea that the commissioner suspended him without allowing law enforcement to finish their investigation, just confirms there is a witch hunt on young black athletes"

"Did he violate the league no gun policy? Yes he did and thats it"

So really it doesn't matter if he broke a law or not as he violated a NBA policy. If they made it where you had to where a blue tie on Wednesday and you showed up with a red one, they would be within their rights to do whatever punishment fits the crime. In this case, Arenas and the other guy created a scenario where really bad "what if's" could have occurred. And not only that, after the fact he was pretty rebellious about it.

I do, however, feel he'll be reinstated at some point and hopefully after some introspection on his part. Vick is a good example of this, in my opinion.

Why do people care about the Tiger Woods thing? Simple. The image everyone created of the "aww, shucks. I'm just here to be the best at my game" (with some assistance from Tiger himself) was rocked. Prior to the incident in question, you could hardly find a person that didn't feel he made for an excellent role model. The only complaints I ever heard about him before was his cursing bad shots under his breath after making a bad swing but that's just the level of athlete he is. He is better than anyone else out there and thus his competition becomes against himself. Would humility be nice? Sure, but who is he really hurting? No one. Luckily, Arenas can say his situation didn't as well but there are loads of possibilities where it could have.

[Zuma]

Originally Posted by Steve

That being I said, I totally agree with him that Gilbert Arenas is getting fucked. Though, not because he's black, but because David is an puritan asshole who believes that NBA players need to held to some superhuman standard as role models, which is disgusting. Just because someone is famous doesn't mean they should have to act like someone something their not.

lolwut? If you, SoL, Brooklyn, Slap, or I took a gun to our job and waived it at a co-worker - what do you think would happen? You'd be fired. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. There would be no "legal issues" - there would be you getting fired, then you dealing with your legal issues on your own, then looking for a job.

SoL - your buddy is crazy. Homie has a whole bunch of other issues that he needs to deal, including some serious paranoia. The media is not "out to get" young black men. There are plenty of stories about good young black men, at least where I am, from the LIBERAL media.

The Mike Vick story is a great example - that fucker shouldn't have been allowed to come back to the NFL, and I hope Arenas isn't allowed to EVER come back to the NBA. What do you have to do to get FIRED? If I waived a gun at a co-worker, I wouldn't be able to come back to my company. I would be FIRED. I might be able to find a job with another company, but not the same company in another city like Vick did. What does it take for an NBA player to be FIRED? Do they have to actually shoot someone in the locker room? Or, would they get to come back after they served a few years in jail? No... they should be FIRED. Period. Goodbye, don't come back.